CFL Expansion

[4th&long]

MLSE also known as Larry Tanenbaum doesn't realize that Toronto is a Maple Leafs town and has a license to print money. Toronto isn't a football town. It 'had arena football that failed after two season, there is no support for USPORTS/CIAU football teams (York and U.of T.) their scores are mentioned in the Toronto Sport networks or on sport radio stations. There is no support for high school football team in Toronto as well. The Buffalo Bills Series was a total failure.

Tanenbaum is also lazy in promoting the Argos and CFL brand in the Ontario region. He recently badmouthed the CFL in a Canadian Press interview a couple of months ago. I bet he changed his tune once his Argos won the Grey Cup this past November.

A NFL sized field inside a CFL field would look ridiculous just for optic sakes. Sightlines for fans would be too far for attendees to see

The Argos have been around for 150 years, if people don't know they exist that's not merely the fault of MLSE. It's like the NJ Devils, despite 3 cup wins most of the state just doesn't care. Unless they're playing the Rangers or Flyers they never sell out, even with the cheapest tickets in the league. Toronto has been apathetic toward the CFL for 30+ years now, and that's not changing. The major markets only want American Football.

Toronto had American Football in the Arena Football leagues Toronto Phantoms, lasted 2 years, The Toronto Rifles from the failed Continental Football League, had a international College Bowl game for one year, the infamous Buffalo Bills in Toronto Series which was cancelled in the middle of a multi year deal. American Football can't crack the Toronto market because it's a Leaf town.

Montreal had the Montreal Machine in the defunct WLAF. It lasted one year and it had declining attendances each week it was in existence.

Canadians have to realize that the CFL is it's only football option because the NFL ain't coming north with high expansion fee, outrageous stadium demands and poor Canadian Dollar exchange

Toronto would love an NFL team, Buffalo won't hence it may not happen. The big 3 cities could support an NFL team but would the NFL do that with CFL and the fuss? And would Seattle want a team in Vancouver?

This issue with Canada, well in sports that is, is at 39mm people - its a small country for 9 teams. That's 5mm per team now. NFL is 32 teams over 330mm people. There just aren't enough teams to move the needle in Canada.

Having said that - that get good viewership, but the NFL does well up there too. As a % of population Canadian do turn in well for both types of Football.

https://3downnation.com/2022/11/19/2022 ... last-year/

[GDAWG]

The NFL is not expanding to Canada. If they are to expand overseas, it will be across the pond with a 4 team European Division.

[super390]

But they don't draw money from low attendance(mainly friends and family members watching) from those other minor sporting events. College stadiums needs a tenant that will bring in higher attendance during the time of the year the school is not open. A pro team fulfills their monetary situation, particularly a summer league like the CFL. Can't always depend on boosters or donators to keep the lights on

You can if the boosters are super rich, which is what many of the Northern based Ivy League schools have as well as most of the schools in the Power 5 Conferences of the SEC, ACC, Big 12, Pac 12 and Big Ten. Many of these Power 5 schools don't need a pro tenant to make money.

The XFL rents out of a college campus at TDECU at Houston. The college must have rich boosters there to keep a pro team like the Roughneck out of the venue. The boosters must be rich since the city is tied to the Oil and Gas industry. The school must need the money if it has a naming rights attached to the stadium.

Besides most of those major college schools stadiums are too small for a a CFL venue. It's the stadiums with an oval track that can house a CFL field, Division 2 schools stadium would fit the bill like Eastern Michigan University(the venue is going to be used by the USFL as a training facility for their Detroit hub), U,of Buffalo, Clemons Stadium, Wein Stadium at Columbia University and University of Pennsylvania. Most of those stadiums I listed are close to major markets like Detroit, Minnesota, Philadelphia, New York and Buffalo. Those are should be the targets for CFL expansion. Those schools can use a pro tenant for their stadiums

Okay, you're out of your depth talking about Houston. The situation for the University of Houston is that the state of Texas has far too many major college football programs. Houston itself has two FBS schools and an FCS school, but they are all overshadowed by Texas and Texas A&M, whose stadiums are bigger than any professional football team in North America. And nowhere except Los Angeles do college teams draw against an NFL franchise. The problem is, the mania for football in my state makes it impossible for college administrators to be realistic; they all think they can build a national championship program, even tiny Baylor and TCU. Rice Stadium was built at 20 times the size of Rice's student body. We even have 15,000 seat high school stadiums that would probably look decent to a CFL fan. They're all absurd misallocations of resources. Thus UH is always engaged in wacky schemes to move itself up to a major program, including building a 40,000 seat stadium that it would never have filled even when it was a Top 10 team. (I know this because when I was a UH student 40 years ago, I was issued free tickets to all the home games except, of course, Texas and Texas A&M. So I went once or twice to the Astrodome to watch very good UH teams play in front of many empty seats.)

The rich boosters didn't attend UH. UH is a commuter school that no one feels much loyalty to, and worse, to put it bluntly, it's seen as a "minority" school that was never part of the Byzantine cultural hierarchy of the old Southwest Conference, where all the old members represented a stereotypical part of the Texas elite. Oilmen came from A&M, Tech, or Rice. UH's boosters are boosters of the city in general, like Tillman Fertitta the restaurant baron.

That's why UH built a stadium too big and expensive and then had to sell naming rights and find tenants. We also have another college stadium with 50,000 seats, a 40,000 seat baseball dome, a 72,000 seat NFL dome, a 20,000 seat MLS park, an NBA arena, and even those expensive high school stadiums all fighting for events to make money.

[GDAWG]

But they don't draw money from low attendance(mainly friends and family members watching) from those other minor sporting events. College stadiums needs a tenant that will bring in higher attendance during the time of the year the school is not open. A pro team fulfills their monetary situation, particularly a summer league like the CFL. Can't always depend on boosters or donators to keep the lights on

You can if the boosters are super rich, which is what many of the Northern based Ivy League schools have as well as most of the schools in the Power 5 Conferences of the SEC, ACC, Big 12, Pac 12 and Big Ten. Many of these Power 5 schools don't need a pro tenant to make money.

The XFL rents out of a college campus at TDECU at Houston. The college must have rich boosters there to keep a pro team like the Roughneck out of the venue. The boosters must be rich since the city is tied to the Oil and Gas industry. The school must need the money if it has a naming rights attached to the stadium.

Besides most of those major college schools stadiums are too small for a a CFL venue. It's the stadiums with an oval track that can house a CFL field, Division 2 schools stadium would fit the bill like Eastern Michigan University(the venue is going to be used by the USFL as a training facility for their Detroit hub), U,of Buffalo, Clemons Stadium, Wein Stadium at Columbia University and University of Pennsylvania. Most of those stadiums I listed are close to major markets like Detroit, Minnesota, Philadelphia, New York and Buffalo. Those are should be the targets for CFL expansion. Those schools can use a pro tenant for their stadiums

Columbia University and Penn do not need pro tenants. They have a rich alumni base where they don't need pro tenants. All Ivy League schools have an affluent alumni base. Warren Buffet went to both schools, Robert Kraft went to Columbia. Former President Trump went to Penn. Former President Obama went to Columbia. So Columbia and Penn don't need a pro tenant. They have a super rich alumni base to where they don't need one.

[DavedaHammer]

You can if the boosters are super rich, which is what many of the Northern based Ivy League schools have as well as most of the schools in the Power 5 Conferences of the SEC, ACC, Big 12, Pac 12 and Big Ten. Many of these Power 5 schools don't need a pro tenant to make money.

The XFL rents out of a college campus at TDECU at Houston. The college must have rich boosters there to keep a pro team like the Roughneck out of the venue. The boosters must be rich since the city is tied to the Oil and Gas industry. The school must need the money if it has a naming rights attached to the stadium.

Besides most of those major college schools stadiums are too small for a a CFL venue. It's the stadiums with an oval track that can house a CFL field, Division 2 schools stadium would fit the bill like Eastern Michigan University(the venue is going to be used by the USFL as a training facility for their Detroit hub), U,of Buffalo, Clemons Stadium, Wein Stadium at Columbia University and University of Pennsylvania. Most of those stadiums I listed are close to major markets like Detroit, Minnesota, Philadelphia, New York and Buffalo. Those are should be the targets for CFL expansion. Those schools can use a pro tenant for their stadiums

Okay, you're out of your depth talking about Houston. The situation for the University of Houston is that the state of Texas has far too many major college football programs. Houston itself has two FBS schools and an FCS school, but they are all overshadowed by Texas and Texas A&M, whose stadiums are bigger than any professional football team in North America. And nowhere except Los Angeles do college teams draw against an NFL franchise. The problem is, the mania for football in my state makes it impossible for college administrators to be realistic; they all think they can build a national championship program, even tiny Baylor and TCU. Rice Stadium was built at 20 times the size of Rice's student body. We even have 15,000 seat high school stadiums that would probably look decent to a CFL fan. They're all absurd misallocations of resources. Thus UH is always engaged in wacky schemes to move itself up to a major program, including building a 40,000 seat stadium that it would never have filled even when it was a Top 10 team. (I know this because when I was a UH student 40 years ago, I was issued free tickets to all the home games except, of course, Texas and Texas A&M. So I went once or twice to the Astrodome to watch very good UH teams play in front of many empty seats.)

The rich boosters didn't attend UH. UH is a commuter school that no one feels much loyalty to, and worse, to put it bluntly, it's seen as a "minority" school that was never part of the Byzantine cultural hierarchy of the old Southwest Conference, where all the old members represented a stereotypical part of the Texas elite. Oilmen came from A&M, Tech, or Rice. UH's boosters are boosters of the city in general, like Tillman Fertitta the restaurant baron.

That's why UH built a stadium too big and expensive and then had to sell naming rights and find tenants. We also have another college stadium with 50,000 seats, a 40,000 seat baseball dome, a 72,000 seat NFL dome, a 20,000 seat MLS park, an NBA arena, and even those expensive high school stadiums all fighting for events to make money.

Never been to Houston.

My point was that schools need money and while take it in any form. If they aren't major schools specializing in college sports, it willbe difficult them to draw money

[DavedaHammer]

You can if the boosters are super rich, which is what many of the Northern based Ivy League schools have as well as most of the schools in the Power 5 Conferences of the SEC, ACC, Big 12, Pac 12 and Big Ten. Many of these Power 5 schools don't need a pro tenant to make money.

The XFL rents out of a college campus at TDECU at Houston. The college must have rich boosters there to keep a pro team like the Roughneck out of the venue. The boosters must be rich since the city is tied to the Oil and Gas industry. The school must need the money if it has a naming rights attached to the stadium.

Besides most of those major college schools stadiums are too small for a a CFL venue. It's the stadiums with an oval track that can house a CFL field, Division 2 schools stadium would fit the bill like Eastern Michigan University(the venue is going to be used by the USFL as a training facility for their Detroit hub), U,of Buffalo, Clemons Stadium, Wein Stadium at Columbia University and University of Pennsylvania. Most of those stadiums I listed are close to major markets like Detroit, Minnesota, Philadelphia, New York and Buffalo. Those are should be the targets for CFL expansion. Those schools can use a pro tenant for their stadiums

Columbia University and Penn do not need pro tenants. They have a rich alumni base where they don't need pro tenants. All Ivy League schools have an affluent alumni base. Warren Buffet went to both schools, Robert Kraft went to Columbia. Former President Trump went to Penn. Former President Obama went to Columbia. So Columbia and Penn don't need a pro tenant. They have a super rich alumni base to where they don't need one.

You don't speak for those institutions. But, the pro teams don't go to those college stadiums because one. Penn is old and run down, the Eagles would never go back to that place if the Link was demolished by a disaster. Columbia looks like it half finished and they named it after Kraft. Those schools don't maintain their stadiums to attract pro teams. I only suggested those places because their stadiums can fit a CFL field. The XFL could've went to those
places. It would've been better than Cashman Field

The rich guys only use those schools to pad their bios. Barack considers himself a Chicagoan than a New Yorker. I don't think he has made a donation to Columbia after his Netflix deal. Buffet hoards his money, but he might donate some money to his alumni schools once he's dead. But those schools are lacking in updated facilities

[GDAWG]

The XFL rents out of a college campus at TDECU at Houston. The college must have rich boosters there to keep a pro team like the Roughneck out of the venue. The boosters must be rich since the city is tied to the Oil and Gas industry. The school must need the money if it has a naming rights attached to the stadium.

Besides most of those major college schools stadiums are too small for a a CFL venue. It's the stadiums with an oval track that can house a CFL field, Division 2 schools stadium would fit the bill like Eastern Michigan University(the venue is going to be used by the USFL as a training facility for their Detroit hub), U,of Buffalo, Clemons Stadium, Wein Stadium at Columbia University and University of Pennsylvania. Most of those stadiums I listed are close to major markets like Detroit, Minnesota, Philadelphia, New York and Buffalo. Those are should be the targets for CFL expansion. Those schools can use a pro tenant for their stadiums

Columbia University and Penn do not need pro tenants. They have a rich alumni base where they don't need pro tenants. All Ivy League schools have an affluent alumni base. Warren Buffet went to both schools, Robert Kraft went to Columbia. Former President Trump went to Penn. Former President Obama went to Columbia. So Columbia and Penn don't need a pro tenant. They have a super rich alumni base to where they don't need one.

You don't speak for those institutions. But, the pro teams don't go to those college stadiums because one. Penn is old and run down, the Eagles would never go back to that place if the Link was demolished by a disaster. Columbia looks like it half finished and they named it after Kraft. Those schools don't maintain their stadiums to attract pro teams. I only suggested those places because their stadiums can fit a CFL field. The XFL could've went to those
places. It would've been better than Cashman Field

The rich guys only use those schools to pad their bios. Barack considers himself a Chicagoan than a New Yorker. I don't think he has made a donation to Columbia after his Netflix deal. Buffet hoards his money, but he might donate some money to his alumni schools once he's dead. But those schools are lacking in updated facilities

The Ivy League are academics focused and not athletics focused. And Penn is considered one of the best facilities for track and field in the United States with the Penn Relays, so it's not old and run down.

Also not every college is open to alternative non-NFL football. There are places in the US (Austin and Columbus) where if you want to put a pro football team, go for the smaller MLS stadium rather than the massive college stadium because it's unlikely that the college will say yes.

[DavedaHammer]

Columbia University and Penn do not need pro tenants. They have a rich alumni base where they don't need pro tenants. All Ivy League schools have an affluent alumni base. Warren Buffet went to both schools, Robert Kraft went to Columbia. Former President Trump went to Penn. Former President Obama went to Columbia. So Columbia and Penn don't need a pro tenant. They have a super rich alumni base to where they don't need one.

You don't speak for those institutions. But, the pro teams don't go to those college stadiums because one. Penn is old and run down, the Eagles would never go back to that place if the Link was demolished by a disaster. Columbia looks like it half finished and they named it after Kraft. Those schools don't maintain their stadiums to attract pro teams. I only suggested those places because their stadiums can fit a CFL field. The XFL could've went to those
places. It would've been better than Cashman Field

The rich guys only use those schools to pad their bios. Barack considers himself a Chicagoan than a New Yorker. I don't think he has made a donation to Columbia after his Netflix deal. Buffet hoards his money, but he might donate some money to his alumni schools once he's dead. But those schools are lacking in updated facilities

The Ivy League are academics focused and not athletics focused. And Penn is considered one of the best facilities for track and field in the United States with the Penn Relays, so it's not old and run down.

Also not every college is open to alternative non-NFL football. There are places in the US (Austin and Columbus) where if you want to put a pro football team, go for the smaller MLS stadium rather than the massive college stadium because it's unlikely that the college will say yes.

So is USPORTs/CIAU, the student athletes don't get a full ride scholarships up in Canada, they pay for their own tuition. But the Canadian Universities still produce football players for the CFL.

I saw a video of Penn on YT. it looked decrepit. The brick exterior showed cracks, the grass surrounding the track needed to be cut.

MLS stadiums won't fit a CFL field. The Argos playing at BMO Field has 17 yard end zones instead of the league mandated 20 yards. I don't think the CFL will allow more than one stadium to shorten it's end zone. BMO will be the exception

[GDAWG]

I think the CFL needs to stabilize itself before even considering expansion South of the Border, including adding a tenth Canadian team. CFL expansion to America is a long, long time away, perhaps not until it happens under the guy who replaces the guy who replaces Ambroise.

[DavedaHammer]

I think the CFL needs to stabilize itself before even considering expansion South of the Border, including adding a tenth Canadian team. CFL expansion to America is a long, long time away, perhaps not until it happens under the guy who replaces the guy who replaces Ambroise.

The CFL can expand on the fly as the Montreal team works out it ownership situation. The Speigel Estate hasn't through the keys on the table as 3 DownNation suggests. The lawyers that are in care of the Estate have to make some free agent signings to replace Harris and Lewis.

People are panicking since the other teams are disclosing their signings prior to the official Free Agent period and the Alouettes have not YET. Danny Macchochia has his hands tied for now, but he will sign a QB in either Evans or Fajardo, both who are better than the aging, immobile Harris.

CFL expansion into the US occurs when either the XFL or USFL fold within the next few years. Ambrosie will still be commish to oversee that execution. Who's to say that the tenth team should be Canadian. A couple of good candidates for ONE US expansion might be Chicago, Detroit, Minnesota(Collegville), Buffalo or Rochester. The CFL needs just ONE for expansion to succeed.