Game thread: UFL Championship, Birmingham Stallions vs San Antonio Brahmas, Sun June 16, 5:00 PM ET, FOX

[steve42]

First and foremost I think this says a lot about Skip Holtz.   Nobody saw this from him when he was hired, least of all me.   It's just one of those cases where the man meets the perfect opportunity for him.   As for the game the Stallions offensive and defensive lines dominated the game and the skill players won by not making too many mistakes and letting it play out.  The league was competitive all year, the championship shutout was very unusual.   

<clipped for brevity>

If The Stallions have any other tricks it's that they have been better by far at finding diamonds in the rough.   Forgotten players who had potential and they have been able to bring that potential to the surface.  Martinez and Matt Corral are probably both in the top half of the QB talent in the league and my guess is both could have been had by other teams but other coaches do not see what Skip and his child prodigy GM Zach Potter see.

For those who do not know Skip hired a 21 year old kid (Potter) as his player personnel guy three years ago.   Who does that?  Everyone else hires some grey headed cigar smoking vet from the NFL.   But in Skips world there are those who can do it and those who can't and he isn't worried about appearances.  

As a Stallions fan since the 80's this is a dream come true but I also know that eventually Potter and Holtz will move on and the Stallions will drop back to the pack.  Until then Giddy UP!   

 

 

I think the thing that was most poignant for me was the game earlier this season where the commentators compared the complexity of the opposing coach's pro-style play calling and the relatively simplistic plays that Skip relies upon.  I believe they referred to him as a "college coach." I don't know why but that seems to be all it takes.  Yes, Skip's relationship with his QBs is more like a mentor than a coach, and all of them seem to flourish under it.  I say don't mess with it.

I was waiting for the first "break them up" comments. I have a friend who made shirts a few years ago in celebration of the Crimson Tide - "Knee Deep in a Dynasty" and I plan to get one to wear to the preseason events next year.  I commented on social media earlier this year that the officiating felt like there was some "Birmingham fatigue" in the UFL and it seemed like no one, especially the former-XFL leadership, wanted to see the Stallions in the post-season.  My answer here is the same as I said to other SEC fans about Alabama for years... "Get better!"

Skip and the Stallions can be beaten, and it doesn't take biased officiating to do it. The Brahmas did it. The Panthers were one uncharacteristic Bates missed kick from doing it in Week 10. It takes focus, determination, and a commitment to excellence. Trick plays and razzle-dazzle won't do it but solid game play will, so don't focus on what the league needs to do to the Stallions. Do what it takes and beat them on the field.

[4th&long]

First and foremost I think this says a lot about Skip Holtz.   Nobody saw this from him when he was hired, least of all me.   It's just one of those cases where the man meets the perfect opportunity for him.   As for the game the Stallions offensive and defensive lines dominated the game and the skill players won by not making too many mistakes and letting it play out.  The league was competitive all year, the championship shutout was very unusual.   

<clipped for brevity>

If The Stallions have any other tricks it's that they have been better by far at finding diamonds in the rough.   Forgotten players who had potential and they have been able to bring that potential to the surface.  Martinez and Matt Corral are probably both in the top half of the QB talent in the league and my guess is both could have been had by other teams but other coaches do not see what Skip and his child prodigy GM Zach Potter see.

For those who do not know Skip hired a 21 year old kid (Potter) as his player personnel guy three years ago.   Who does that?  Everyone else hires some grey headed cigar smoking vet from the NFL.   But in Skips world there are those who can do it and those who can't and he isn't worried about appearances.  

As a Stallions fan since the 80's this is a dream come true but I also know that eventually Potter and Holtz will move on and the Stallions will drop back to the pack.  Until then Giddy UP!   

 

I think the thing that was most poignant for me was the game earlier this season where the commentators compared the complexity of the opposing coach's pro-style play calling and the relatively simplistic plays that Skip relies upon.  I believe they referred to him as a "college coach." I don't know why but that seems to be all it takes.  Yes, Skip's relationship with his QBs is more like a mentor than a coach, and all of them seem to flourish under it.  I say don't mess with it.

I was waiting for the first "break them up" comments. I have a friend who made shirts a few years ago in celebration of the Crimson Tide - "Knee Deep in a Dynasty" and I plan to get one to wear to the preseason events next year.  I commented on social media earlier this year that the officiating felt like there was some "Birmingham fatigue" in the UFL and it seemed like no one, especially the former-XFL leadership, wanted to see the Stallions in the post-season.  My answer here is the same as I said to other SEC fans about Alabama for years... "Get better!"

Skip and the Stallions can be beaten, and it doesn't take biased officiating to do it. The Brahmas did it. The Panthers were one uncharacteristic Bates missed kick from doing it in Week 10. It takes focus, determination, and a commitment to excellence. Trick plays and razzle-dazzle won't do it but solid game play will, so don't focus on what the league needs to do to the Stallions. Do what it takes and beat them on the field.

I think you guys sum it up here.  Keep in mind though its 1 ownership for all teams so they could pass a rule for "equitable" trades for stacked teams.
As far as coaching style, the entire NFL is going to a more college style running QB offense.  Skip came from college, that's what he knows best. 
As far as SA - AJ Smith fizzled late last yr too, its how the 4-6 AR got to the championship.  These two def were good and a few quick passes and hard running was what Birm went to.  Garbers was holding the ball too long and sliding before getting first.  SA had a bad game on the wrong day.  Also the Stallions got healthy at the right time.

I think you will see more balance next year, you did in USFL year 2.

[MGB01]

First and foremost I think this says a lot about Skip Holtz.   Nobody saw this from him when he was hired, least of all me.   It's just one of those cases where the man meets the perfect opportunity for him.   As for the game the Stallions offensive and defensive lines dominated the game and the skill players won by not making too many mistakes and letting it play out.  The league was competitive all year, the championship shutout was very unusual.   

<clipped for brevity>

If The Stallions have any other tricks it's that they have been better by far at finding diamonds in the rough.   Forgotten players who had potential and they have been able to bring that potential to the surface.  Martinez and Matt Corral are probably both in the top half of the QB talent in the league and my guess is both could have been had by other teams but other coaches do not see what Skip and his child prodigy GM Zach Potter see.

For those who do not know Skip hired a 21 year old kid (Potter) as his player personnel guy three years ago.   Who does that?  Everyone else hires some grey headed cigar smoking vet from the NFL.   But in Skips world there are those who can do it and those who can't and he isn't worried about appearances.  

As a Stallions fan since the 80's this is a dream come true but I also know that eventually Potter and Holtz will move on and the Stallions will drop back to the pack.  Until then Giddy UP!   

 

I think the thing that was most poignant for me was the game earlier this season where the commentators compared the complexity of the opposing coach's pro-style play calling and the relatively simplistic plays that Skip relies upon.  I believe they referred to him as a "college coach." I don't know why but that seems to be all it takes.  Yes, Skip's relationship with his QBs is more like a mentor than a coach, and all of them seem to flourish under it.  I say don't mess with it.

I was waiting for the first "break them up" comments. I have a friend who made shirts a few years ago in celebration of the Crimson Tide - "Knee Deep in a Dynasty" and I plan to get one to wear to the preseason events next year.  I commented on social media earlier this year that the officiating felt like there was some "Birmingham fatigue" in the UFL and it seemed like no one, especially the former-XFL leadership, wanted to see the Stallions in the post-season.  My answer here is the same as I said to other SEC fans about Alabama for years... "Get better!"

Skip and the Stallions can be beaten, and it doesn't take biased officiating to do it. The Brahmas did it. The Panthers were one uncharacteristic Bates missed kick from doing it in Week 10. It takes focus, determination, and a commitment to excellence. Trick plays and razzle-dazzle won't do it but solid game play will, so don't focus on what the league needs to do to the Stallions. Do what it takes and beat them on the field.

 

 

This. Any garbage of "fix the league" this, "competitive balance" that can go back to Reddit where it belongs. 

That said, I doubt there was really that much anti-Birmingham sentiment on the XFL side, why else would they have gone for the merger so quickly? I see two things: Birmingham and FOX. If anything, it worked out the way they wanted (really, STL advancing would have been the cherry on top).

[4th&long]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYDOS7fdQRI

UFL Today show  -Sam Acho segment on the game etc...

[steve42]

That said, I doubt there was really that much anti-Birmingham sentiment on the XFL side, why else would they have gone for the merger so quickly? 

I can think of about 65 million reasons. What I have never understood is why the league that took a bath financially in 2023 came into the new league appearing to call the shots. All we hear is The Rock and Dany Garcia.  Moose and Fox seem content to let the XFL leadership be the face of the UFL.

[laxtreme56]

That said, I doubt there was really that much anti-Birmingham sentiment on the XFL side, why else would they have gone for the merger so quickly? 

I can think of about 65 million reasons. What I have never understood is why the league that took a bath financially in 2023 came into the new league appearing to call the shots. All we hear is The Rock and Dany Garcia.  Moose and Fox seem content to let the XFL leadership be the face of the UFL.

We don't know what the USFL financial picture was, but odds are, it wasn't nearly as rosy as some think. Or else they would've just let the XFL bleed out and pick up whatever remains were left. I have a feeling Moose will quietly be let go this off-season or next. 

[GregParks]

The idea that the USFL wasn’t some money loser for FOX just because financials never got leaked like the XFL’s is strange to me. I guess maybe they got some $ from their NBC deal and advertising (though that would mostly go to FOX I would imagine not necessarily the USFL). Attendance was negligible so they didn’t make much off that. Their hubs saved some money but I don’t see this giant revenue stream that would make up for the natural expenses you get from running a football league.

[steve42]

We can choose to accept the league's statements that they made about $7.5 million in 2023 or not.  That number was oft-repeated but poorly sourced.  The fact that Fox was treating the USFL like reality-sports television and asserted that their business model relied upon television revenue and not ticket sales seems to indicate that the number is possible.

I hope you are wrong about Moose. He was visible in Birmingham for the 2024 season and has proven he is willing to meet and talk with the fans.  The Rock has only been seen in commercials for his products and a single UFL hype video clip on the Jumbotron (which I believe was actually footage shot by the XFL in 2023 with bad voice dub-over of the acronym "UFL") and Dany only showed up for the USFL conference championship. I haven't spoken with a single Stallions fan who didn't feel like a red-headed step-child of Daddy-XFL the entire season. If they push the former USFL leadership out, I can absolutely see a subsequent move to relocate the Stallions, and for all Birmingham's attendance woes, I don't know if another city embraces the team.

[4th&long]

The idea that the USFL wasn’t some money loser for FOX just because financials never got leaked like the XFL’s is strange to me. I guess maybe they got some $ from their NBC deal and advertising (though that would mostly go to FOX I would imagine not necessarily the USFL). Attendance was negligible so they didn’t make much off that. Their hubs saved some money but I don’t see this giant revenue stream that would make up for the natural expenses you get from running a football league.

 

 

The USFL was a still relatively inexpensive way to get TV ratings on Fox, as is UFL.  Fox is a TV network, they want unique programming and sports programming.  They owned the property which meant they control when where its on TV.  They still have much of that control in the UFL and half the risk.
Are we still discussing the reason for the merger?  Two leagues were never going to make it.  One has a strong chance. Everyone knew that, it was a fools errand to launch the XFL in 2023, they should have just merged prior to that season.   And Once both sides acknowledged they're in for long haul and the other accepted that reality (likely before the 2023 seasons), it was a done deal.  A stronger ABC/ESPN takes the place of NBC and RBC & Disney (to lesser extent) became the investors Fox sought.  And the reverse is true from XFL side.  Its win-win.

[GregParks]

 

We can choose to accept the league's statements that they made about $7.5 million in 2023 or not.  That number was oft-repeated but poorly sourced.  The fact that Fox was treating the USFL like reality-sports television and asserted that their business model relied upon television revenue and not ticket sales seems to indicate that the number is possible.

I promise not to go too far down this road because honestly all of this is irrelevant anyway but...

Let's do a little basic math. USFL players were paid about 53,000 per year last year. 50 players per team, that's about $21 million for player salary, not counting those on IR, etc. Then take into account coach salaries, salaries of league executives, insurance, rent to the stadiums, and on and on. A conservative estimate for all of that would be about $30 million. Now, if you assume they not only covered all of that cost PLUS made $7.5 million in profit (and remember, profit and revenue are NOT the same), then I'd ask anyone throwing around that number (not picking on you, steve) as gospel to show your work and tell me where that nearly $40 million in revenue came from. 

Another way to look at this: The XFL and USFL were REALLY not that different in 2023 in how they operated. Same number of teams, similar number of players, salaries, etc. XFL paid their coaches a little more. The big differences were start-up costs (that probably was a big chunk of that $65 million in losses, which makes the comparison apples-to-oranges to begin with, because that would not be factored into a USFL season two) for the XFL, and the additional four stadium leases. Looking at how similar they really are, I don't see how you get the $70+ million difference between what the XFL is said to have lost and the USFL is said to have made.